TalkClimateChange

When reality rams right into the mitigation bus on the motorway into the future, the accident is not so pretty.

As an exercice simply take the number of people living just above the poverty line within 30% of the income number. Then push them all below the line. This works in any developed country. That is the sacrifice you just made to the mitigation gods.

push for renewables, meaning solar-wind-geothermal-passive insulation and retrofits with sustainables…now.
otherwise all monies will be sunk into the last of the fossils and into the next nuclear nightmare.

no compromise, no promise. no politics, flood the politicians with public demand.

Ok Nadine thanks for the solution. Please start up a company, raise the capital, install all your green energy and save the world. Should be easy since the world is so hungry for it. Or perhaps you thing the government should do everything for you because you do not have the will to help yourself?

So when are you going to flood politicians with your new “green” army?

Here have a t-shirt a beret and a sign and stand off way to left.

I repeat my call for public referendum with binding results.

I must have banged on about this in the forum somewhere before.

The problem with Excess Winter Deaths is that old people tend to spend their fuel allowance on Xmas presents for their kids. I kid you not.

Combined heat and power and insulation are the best ways (IMO) to go about solving the problem. Evidence from this comes from Scandinavia; despite having colder and harsher winters, they have less EWD. Is it a coincidence that they also have CHP systems?

The country with the most EWD? Portugal.

I meant grand-kids of course.

So lets look at what is really happening here.

More poor = More Social Services

More Social Services = More taxes

More taxes = More Poor

You will reach a balance, but the effect on the society will be to further divide and create a new level of society I will call the working welfare class.

Perhaps the development of non-profit electricity production is in order for developed countries?

Very socialist of me I know but how do you reconcile needs with mitigation mandates?

Oh! Heretic…
my comments, as my blogs come from empirical data, not tabletop rhetoric.
i am out here boots and mittens sawing dead trees to keep warm, have spent one tank of gas in 6 months and grow my own veges, cook from scratch and rely on no assistance whatsoever. i use creative recycling to insulate and sew window covers, and teach the arts of self reliance.
please never assume that people do not “have the will to help themselves” as stated in your comment.
i was not clear in my remark.

i meant flood politicians with accurate data about the conservative merits of renewables/sustainables (and insulation/retrofits) as an alternative to polluting fossil/nuclear energy.

that established, i relish the antithetical viewpoints which you present so well to assist critical problem solving skills.

Nadine,

I apologize my sarcastic gene kicked in really bad this week.

I do not think convincing politicans is a problem anymore, it is how best to solve the issue. IMO we could perhaps finally define the goal that might be a good start. Even I realize my calls for public referendum are certainly too late!

EU has made binding targets, we have them Canada (although not quite as harsh 20% by 2010) we will sign the UNFCCC agreement if only to save environmental face, the US will be onboard next spring.

I have pretty much resigned myself to this. I was never against renewable energy and sustainability. I recycle I seldom drive I do all the things I am supposed to, yet I have friends in the manufacturing industry, who are barely able to hang on now, that tell me they will shut the doors if taxes and trading are implemented. Why go broke trying to stream upstream?

I was against and still am the legislation of these changes to happen in a unrealistic period of time, taxes and new artifical markets for something intangible as emisssions. This is not acceptable to me and should not be to anyone.

All this regulation and taxes and transferred wealth comes hidden under the skirt of climate change. Auctioned off as a slave girl to every cause that never made it to the mainstream before.

Are you aware it is the responsibility of industry to report their emissions? Now they know a tax is coming and emission reduction targets,I am pretty sure some have padded the heck out their numbers, toss in an extra 10% right off the top. Save some cash. There is no agency or regulator for actual GHG emissions reporting amd verification, at least not in my country.

Other sectors like cars and commercial transport are based on the relative consumption and average emissions, not with any sort of resolution of detail that would allow a tax, so they tax the fuel. Will not reduce commercial consumption, food and goods need to get to the shelves and the tax will just get passed along as higher transport costs factored into overall food costs.

So Government is really ill equipped to manage this transformation. They cannot even get the simple concept of “you cannot keep spending more than you make”. So how can they efficently transform a society?

Can humanity switch energy sources, you bet!
Will we have to adapt anyways to climate change, yes.

Do we need to knock society down a economic peg to do it?

That is the 10,000 Question.

We cannot get back something that is gone ( our pre-industrial climate ), we may also have to accept that we may need to increase emissions short term to reduce them long term. This will not play well in the activist camp. They still block renewables projects for their pet causes!

I just do not believe in the forced transfer of money from one industry to another by legislation from the government, nor do I believe for one minute that any taxes and operational expenses from a price on carbon will not end up in the sticker price of everything I buy and be squandered and/or mismanged by my elected leaders.

I think we need a better plan, I have some ideas but public pressure on politicians will never see this type of plan implemented, you see some groups will never accept anything as going “far enough”. Some like me will be saying “too far”.

So to recap I do not think we need government to make this happen, and if we are actually going to succeed then we really do not need them involved. Hence my help yourself statement, why lobby government? Instead look around your community and see what industries are there, go to them and ask, nicely, do not picket or protest, to see if they cannot come up with some solutions.

Emission reduction targets, if they are realistic and achievable, should be the only role of Government but how we do it should be left up to the innovators and entrepenuers, not a senate commitee getting input from environmental lobbyists on the validity of requests for funds.

In my opinion anyways.